Lock this boy up and force feed him Dream Theater's first six and Opeth's first eight!

In fact, he needs ALL of DT’s catalog, otherwise he’ll miss out on modern classics “Bridges In the Sky”, and “At Wit’s End”, among other megaliths that define prog metal.
Ok, maybe we overlook their abysmal concept album…

A question that’s been plaguing me for sometimes (probably because I need more homework, but whatever): do you think there is a regional mentality when it preferences in metal?

As a power metal fan I’m constantly reflecting on how few power metal bands we have in my country, and a smaller fan base for the genre; yet black, death, especially melodeath, and core related stuff are inherently more popular. Even within power metal it tend to be the ballads rather that the anthems that gets more attention. And then we have Germany pushing out one classic after another.

It seems to be the same out there with other genres; while not implying that bands coming out of these countries are necessarily the best, when you mention, for example, black metal from Norway, there’s almost an expectation of it being good (or maybe it’s just my own stereotypes - I’m much less familiar with extreme stuff). And you would definitely see more power metal fans in, say, Finland than in the US. Sometimes I cannot help but wondering whether or not this sort of general preference comes with development and such.

So, your thoughts?

I'm probably chatting shit with this, but it's something I've often thought and never really looked into.

I've listened to a fair bit of Children of Bodom, Sentenced, Stratovarius, Sonata Arctica, Kalmah, Swallow the Sun, Catamenia, Lullacry, Amorphis, as well as a few non metal acts such as HIM and Poets of the Fall. All Finnish bands, and bands that I think have melodies as a key part of their sound (be it through melodies that help carry the song or licks / solos). To me, many of these melodies are distinctive, and are unlike anything non-Finnish bands come up with. They just sound Finnish. Even if I think of modern Kreator, their guitarist Sami is Finnish, and gives some of their songs a bit of that Finnish flair. There's no other country I can think of where I get this feeling when listening to their musical acts.

My (somewhat broad) question would be, is there anything about these melodies that might make them sound uniquely Finnish? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I read that music is compulsory in childhood education in Finland - could there be scales, patterns, history, ideas etc picked up early in their development that would carry over to a later musical career? Does anyone have experience of what this education is like? Is there anything to this idea? Or am I just thinking this because I subconsciously know all of these bands are Finnish and I'm making a connection that isn't really there.

I’ve had this line of thought as well, I remember remarking in one of my rambles that most melodic metal coming from Finland have that distinctive Finnish sound, especially as the genre goes more extreme. Like how Children of Bodom is not folk but I have often connect them with Ensiferum for some reasons. Or you may say that metal is folk music in Finland lol

For me that distinctive Finnish sound probably lies the way they thread guitar and keyboard melody together(?) and in certain guitar tones as well as keyboard progression that usually results in Finnish power metal being far more melodic, but not in the sense of those 3rd Wave bands.I’m not really a huge fan of such hyper-melodic stuff but I understand the aesthetic.

And for the record, you can actually tell if a power metal band is German or not, purely riff-wise; all the more so if the band falls more on the heavy/power side of the spectrum.

I'd guess your subconscious plays a small part in it, but there could be something else at play as well. Finnish education is top class, but that hardly plays a role in a music theory sense. What it does probably do (or did at least, I have no idea what they do in music class these days) is imbue the students with old songs of the folk and schlager variety in the form of group singing. Radio and the music habits of parents also played a role in that generation's bands, so it's probably the old Finnish folk and schlager songs which permeate the "Finnish melodic metal sound".


It has been said that the electric guitar is the new accordion.

Never heard of the project, but I'll going to check it out soon, thanks!

Huh, at least you still have music as part of your curriculum.

I think this has to be a "scene" thing. Most people I meet in China who say they are into rock music mean something like Linkin Park or almost some pop bands. If you want to play metal gigs, you need to become part of the metal scene, and the scene is almost entirely underground and independent. So playing brutal stuff makes sense. Power metal doesn't really fit that idea, because it's not significantly different from mainstream pop and rock music (you could play it on the radio, it usually doesn't have harsh vocals). Also, I'm not sure how this fits in, but lots of Chinese pop ballads have really kickass guitar solos and really soft lyrics, so I think power metal ballads can often cross over to mainstream music.

To make that answer a bit wider, fans will often listen to what they hear about, and local bands might be the earliest influences, certainly in terms of seeing gigs. Also, if Finland for example has some extreme but melodic bands playing shows, it would be easy for another extreme but melodic band to come and play a show with them, and they would definitely be influenced from each other somewhat. With the internet now, this isn't the only way to make connections, but it still has its own importance.

You’ve met people that like Linkin Park? Lucky, all I’ve met are classmates that think Imagine Dragon rock ‘n’ roll. And the Chinese habit of calling all music with even the faintest sound of guitar rock ‘n’ roll does not help. Most of the time, it’s just heavy metal and all the specific varieties of extreme metal. Power metal has no name for the general crowd and us that insist on categorization are called gatekeepers lol. Also, there’s the ridiculous concept of ,,Rock ‘n’ Roll Spirit” …

Personally I’ve been thinking that it has something to do with a nation’s mentality. Concerning China, one theory that I’ve played around with is that there is a difference in the way Chinese and English language convey ideas. English is generally blunt, while Chinese is more tactful. The one most obvious example I’ve noticed is that Chinese people tend to associate music with feelings. If you use Netease music, just take a look at the comment section of any random power metal ballad and compare it to a regular song, it’s almost inevitable that there will be a few thousands comments difference. And most of those comments will be about a random life story (usually tragic) that the song reminds them of. While there is nothing fundamentally wrong about telling your life story in the comment section, I would still rather read some analysis of the music (most of these people are trolls anyways, that just makes them more annoying). Even when I come across reviews on the Internet, they tend to focus on the emotions that the music induced or they use really glamorous but somewhat empty words to describe the music. It works, but it’s a boring POV after repetition.



Ah, you’ve hit a sour spot there - it’s a well known fact in the more secluded circle of power metal fans here that Forever is a fucking pop song.lol



True true, I might add that one’s initial entry into music plays a big part as well. I can’t really imagine someone loving EDM before getting into rock, whilst the other way around sounds equally unfathomable. There might be exceptions, but we’re talking about the mass.

Oof, good points. Somehow I never thought about it that way.


Bloody hell, and here I thought Aquilus was bad enough. I love the music, but I can't take the lyrics seriously because they keep giving me the mental image of Waldorf looking very ponderously at, idk autumn leaves, and flipping through a dictionary in search of the perfect words for his poetry. It's especially ridiculous on Latent Thistle.

I don't know if there's ever been more serious analysis done of it, but I suspect it's just a few prominent examples skewing our perception. Particularly Bench, plus a few others like Mia Wallace, Lena Abe, Vanja Slajh, Doris Yeh, etc. Bench's prominence with Bolt Thrower surely had a lot of influence on the scene, and we're extreme metal-focused on this forum, so it makes perfect sense. Women who play guitar or drums of late seem to have more of a niche on social media like Youtube, and in other genres of music. Maybe if Bench had been BT's drummer things would be very different.



Yeah, Sandrine Bourguignon is on Leading Vision. There are lot of others though, various Cindy Blackman projects, Sheila E., The White Stripes, The Carpenters, The Velvet Underground, plus various less known ones like Terri Lyne Carrington, Nevell. I learned this lesson at an early age, one of my first jazz concerts was Lee Ritenour, and the woman on the kit (wish I knew who she was now, I wasn't well-versed yet at the time) was on the same level as the rest of the band, at least to my fledgling ears.

In my experience, if the sole female member isn't the lead singer then she's the keyboardist.

Depends on the band, to be honest. I don’t listen to any NS garbage, but other than that, I don’t really care about the complexity or content of the language used, although I almost always read the lyrics.

As we all know, a lot of bands just stick to the blood, guts, and satan theme in their lyrics, some of which are so basic and one dimensional that it makes the most incoherent engrish babbling seem like the language of Victorian high society, and I usually couldn’t care less about it.

However, bands like Nile and Mgła, which are some of my favorites of all time, pull the complex lyric thing off. And then back on. And then off again. Shit never gets old. Going over the lyrics of the Nile song Von Unaussprechlichen Kulten in my head gives me goosebumps, whether I’m listening to the music or not.

Linkin Park was the first example I thought of. That 'Minutes to Midnight' t-shirt is just everywhere, and I think that's the stuff that those guys are familiar with, not the nu metal songs from LP. But yes, any "band" with a guitar is rock, or any artist with "attitude" is rock 'n' roll.

I didn't think about the lyrics and mentality part. Tbh, most of the metal that's popular in China has harsh vocals, so already you know those bands are focusing less on specific lyrics. I find a lot of popular Chinese songs have fairly simple (and always emotional) lyrics, so despite not reading comments on NetEase (don't fancy that lol) I can imagine the situation. I guess that may also be how kids are conditioned to think about art, it's not just supposed to be entertainment, you should find the deeper meaning. I do not find the deeper meaning in Municipal Waste or Cannibal Corpse.

And maybe that's why the Finns have those special melodies. I'm using a stereotype but I think Finns may agree that they are fairly reserved people and may not communicate their emotions directly that often. But listening to a musical expression of a particular emotion ("bittersweet" is how I'd describe Finnish melody) may make people understand without speaking. We should ask the Finns in this group if they can view it like this.

I don't think this question is that specific, but I don't feel like making a whole thread on this.

Why exactly does symphonic metal have more female singers than the other metal subgenres? Is it due to the feminine value that helps amplify the atmosphere, or is it just a Nightwish-worshipping phenomenon?

For me personally victorian and gothic-y styles of music are more feminine hence why women are attracted to performing in these genres

It's a combination of those and women generally being more interested in singing than in playing instruments, and symphonic metal is more vocal-focused than most metal genres. It also lends itself more to the sort of theatrical fashion that some of them like. And it additionally just builds on itself, with Tarja, Sharon den Adel, Simone Simmons and others setting the template to follow.

Oh that, that shit’s called ,,fashion “.



Hmmm… maybe I should’ve word my opinions differently, what I was thinking is that the way our languages were formed affects the method certain ideas are conveyed and hence the focal in producing different aspects of the music. So it’s not all about lyrics, you’ll find atmospheric stuff being more receptive as well. Though it’s true most metal in China are more guitar-centric.

But yes, the curriculum requires us to look for metaphors and hidden meanings and such in art. It’s a farce really, but I’m not here to shit on the education system.

Off topic, if you use Netease… how about following each other?

I use it a bit, but I'm not even sure that I have an account. Definitely I've never had VIP for it, so I guess there isn't much information on my account if you add me. Most of my music is downloaded to my computer and Ipod and it's stuff I actually own.

Which makes me think of this question...
How many of you are still using a purpose-built mp3 device like Ipod?

I have one, though it’s not an Ipod, and 4 cards with the total memory of 216 GB . Can’t have my phone with me at school ya know. But I must have my regular dose of power metal lol.

Also another somewhat specific question

This is an old of metal band concentration by US state (I know it's a couple years outdated, but I think it's still pretty valid):


source: https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/commen ... m_each_us/

As we can see here, Oregon has the highest concentration here, probably due to the Cascadian black metal/PN doom metal scene going on there. But I wonder why is Florida, a state with Trivium, Kamelot, Iced Earth, and an entire death metal scene, so low? Is it due to the retiree population there?

Of course, on a side note, it's also important to consider that the MA has (understandably) a strict definition on what constitute as "metal," and the general populace is more broad on what they do think of as metal. I'm pretty sure if it's hard rock/metal concentration, the numbers would probably get substantially higher, especially with Ohio and its metalcore going on.


Also another question: does power metal also have officially recognized regional distinct scenes like many other subgenres have? Thrash has Bay Area/East Coast/Teutonic, death has Sweden/Florida/a bit of NYC, black has Norway/France, doom has Finland/Louisiana/Maryland, and metalcore has SE England/Ohio. I know USPM and EUPM are common differentiators, but I'm thinking of something more specific than that. I think Japan is the closest to a "scene" when it comes to power metal.

I still have an iPod Classic, with an overclocked 512GB hard drive in it. I absolutely love it due to its space and durability that I can't get from a phone. I hate that they're not being made anymore. When this one breaks I'll have to resort to eBay or something to replace it.

I don’t know about strictly official stuff. After all, power metal is still a minority comparing to the other more extreme genres and hence we have less bands, which makes it harder to formulate a scene in a strict sense.

But when I’m reviewing I tend to apply three standards of categorization and one of them is to do it by a regional variants. Overlapping with what me and gas had discussed before, there’s obviously a distinct style to the Finnish variant. And surely Germany have a style as well, albeit one less specific, but you would definitely see people referring to bands like Running Wild or Grave Digger as Teutonic power metal, I know I have. Personally I split them as German, Finnish, Swedish, Italian, South American, USPM and Japanese. Granted, I sometimes use them as a synonym for stylistic variants, like German for the more heavy/thrash/power mix, or Italian for the more symphonic side of the spectrum. But you can’t deny there’s a subtle tendency that makes those power metal bands unique to the country they belong to, like Hammerfall for the Swedes or Angra for South America. And bands coming out of countries with less focal on power metal usually adheres to those distinctions. You don’t call Heavenly French power metal, you call them power metal coming from France that bears a strong resemblance to the German Gods.

Just my two cents.

I can't really speak for the map part, but power metal definitely has recognized regional scenes. German power metal is probably the most recognizable, followed by a different kind of power/symphonic in Finland/Norway area. And US power metal (USPM) obviously has its own classification, but it's not exactly considered power metal in the same fashion as the European stuff. I'm not sure of the concentration of those US bands, but it would include older '80s stuff like Virgin Steele, Manilla Road, Brocas Helm, Jag Panzer.

EDIT: also, I should refresh my page before replying to posts



This is exactly why I use mine, except I just use the standard storage space, which is 128GB. It means I rotate what music I have on there, but that's still plenty of space for stuff that's new and albums I frequently listen to.

Main problem I'm having with my, um, 13/14 year old iPod is the battery is pretty poor nowadays. It's nowhere near the battery diminishment on actual iPhones, but I need to charge it after any extended listening session. My sister has a slightly older one, and hers literally doesn't work unless it's plugged in, sort of making it pointless as a portable device, although she still takes it to work because her computer there doesn't have iTunes.

I'd love to, but all of mine either broke or were rendered unusable due to programmed obsolescence.

Currently using a knock off Mp3 player that was way cheaper.

I agree about the battery as mine is at nowhere near the capacity it used to be. I can still use it outside for a little bit but it will need charging more often.

As for the 128GB and rotation of music, I upgraded because I didn't want to rotate. There's a place in Sydney (assuming it's still there) that upgraded iPods (and presumably other Apple products) as long as you're fine with voiding warranty. I can even get a new battery there if my battery stuffs up.

Thinking about this the other day, oddly enough. They're all great titles! I kinda wish they'd kept up with that kind of wordplay.

We're also the Birthplace of Black N' Blue (80's mainstream metal), Wehrmacht (crossover thrash), and punk-rock legends Poison Idea!

Reminds me of Dimmu Borgir...3 word titles.

Godless Savage Garden
Enthrone Darkness Triumphant
Spiritual Black Dimensions
Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia
Death Cult Armageddon

Take a look at Anvil's album titles for an even more basic formula.

What actually came out of the Batushka lawsuit? Any conclusion?

And why does like half of all new black metal bands on the site have "Void" in the name?

What makes this black metal and not death metal? I realize that growling vocals alone do not death metal make, I'm just curious what elements of this are constituting it as black metal as opposed to death. If someone were to ask me that question about more straightforward black metal bands (Burzum, Mayhem, Emperor, etc.) I could answer it, but its more challenging for me to articulate that difference with this particular band. They remind me more of bands like Ulcerate as opposed to other black metal bands, but of course that's subjective.

My 160GB classic no longer will sync so I had to retire it and bust out an old 80GB classic that I use in the car. I should have bought a new iPod touch but have switched to mostly my phone or plugging a flash drive into my car. I loved my iPods.

I'd really like non-Apple mp3 players if their interface were as easy to work with. That said, iPods really take a hit with not being able to have customizable storage options. Anyone got any recommendations for music players that aren't a total headache to navigate?

I LIKE "Godless Savage Garden", but the rest seem like random "dar" or "Evil" sounding words randomly strung together!

One of my favorite opening tracks in the history of metal is Gardens of the Sinner by Gamma Ray. Few other tracks can set such an immediately gargantuan tone for the album, with such epic scope and so much movement and color into such a concise window. They nailed it immediately and this should have opened every set for the following twenty years if there was any justice in the world.

The weird thing about that song though is that it's not the opening track. This, the Most Obvious Opener ever written is track five for some utterly baffling reason that I've never understood.

Any other examples of this sort of thing? Songs that sound like they should logically kick the album off but are nestled somewhere in the middle instead? Only other example off the top of my head is Blind Guardian's Welcome to Dying being the second track on its home album, but honestly it's just as good as the actual opener and it only feels misplaced because "Welcome" is in the title and it's almost the first song so it really stands out.

What's your guys' opinions on intro/outro tracks? Are they ever warranted or are they needlessly snooty and shoe-horned into most albums?

I prefer intros to outros. I like them even better if the intro blends into the 2nd track seamlessly, as it then feels like a proper introduction rather than another track.

One of my favourite intro tracks is Mithras's "Portal to the..." - sounds great and does well with the rest of the album.

Case by case basis. Most of them are pointless, but then there are those rare cases where they are absolutely essential. Case in point, Initiation and Follow the Sign on Keeper of the Seven Keys Part 1. The album would not be as great as it is without those two tracks. But I still maintain that Initiation should've been an intro section on the same track as I'm Alive rather than being its own track.

Oh speaking of essential intros, The Hellion/Electric Eye.